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Brannon Howse: First, let's go to Sheriff Mack. He is a patriot. That is also a former sheriff who is trying to educate the public across America on the need to put into power Constitutional Sheriffs. One reason is to stop the tyranny, the stealing of our freedom of speech, our freedom of religion, and our civil liberties. Sheriff Mack, welcome back to Lindell TV. Thanks for joining us tonight.
Sheriff Mack: Great to be back with you. Thanks for having me.
Brannon Howse: Tell us the name of your organization for those who maybe don't know because we're always adding new people.
Sheriff Mack: C. S. P. O. A. Stands for Constitutional Sheriffs Peace Officers Association, cspoa.org. The CSPOA provides the United States of America and the people there in a legitimate, effective, and peaceful solution to all the tyranny that is going on today. And it happens county by county, which increases the chances that it will possibly go across the states. So, we take back America county by county, state by state one good Sheriff at a time with the American people in his county so that we can restore our Constitution, civil rights, and individual liberty as intended by our Founding Fathers.
It would require that every Sheriff in the country, and we're not going to ever pretend that we're going to get all sheriffs, but if we get a third, that means a thousand sheriffs. There are a little over 3,000 sheriffs in America. If we get 1,000, then the American people will be blessed with someone they can turn to for peace, safety, protection, and liberty in their counties. And everybody else, if you don't have a constitutional sheriff, you'll have someplace to move close by where you can do the same.
Brannon Howse: That's excellent. So, let's talk about why Constitutional Sheriffs? What is it that makes the Sheriffs and their job maybe more powerful as a magistrate than, let's say, a Chief of Police?
Sheriff Mack: Well, the Chief of Police is a bureaucrat. I don't begrudge the chiefs of police. That's the nature of the beast of their jobs. But they report to a city council or, even worse, an appointed town manager or a city manager. So. he's not reporting to the people, and the Sheriff does. The Sheriff is elected, and that is hugely important. Okay. Because he must please the people. And he must do one thing that he already promised the people when he took his job. That is his solemn oath of office to uphold and defend the Constitution and thereby protect the people's God-given rights that are guaranteed and detailed within the Bill of Rights. We are used to a lot of things going on, and there are a lot of things going on. But liberty is the most important thing that should be going on across our country.
We train patrol officers, detectives, chiefs of police, sheriffs, deputies, jailers, and county commissioners. We train all public officials, but especially police and sheriffs, that their duty is to protect liberty and to put liberty first in the execution of their job. If we can understand that and have that training in every police academy in this country, we will take America back because we'll have a police force across this country and Sheriffs across this country that will tell the federal agents and maybe state agents that there's a few things in my county you're not going to do anymore. And one of them is arresting people for not wearing a diaper on their face. Another one is that they don't have to show you or anyone else their personal medical history in order to go inside a building.
That is all unlawful, it is all unconstitutional, and if we really believe in personal choice and individual liberty, then we would have never had all of these mandates. And as Jefferson said, "In a republic such as ours, we can persuade the people, we can teach the people, but we cannot force the people." We, the people, are in charge of this government. They report to us, not us to them. We are not subject to their whims. And the Sheriff is the ultimate protector of the people.
We hope the chiefs of police join this holy cause as well. But it really works with the people of the United States and everyone that is listening to your program right now. Every citizen should become a member of the CSPOA posse. Go to CSPOA.org, become a member, and become a part of the solution. Join our weekly webinars for training on how you can become a part of helping your Sheriff stand for liberty and take America back in a peaceful and effective manner.
Brannon Howse: Excellent. Let me ask you. I don't think I've had you on since we've had the FBI going around and knocking down the doors of so many Americans who are not criminals. They're not violent people. I think of Roger Stone, what they did to him. I think of my friend Tina Peters in Colorado. Sherronna Bishop, who we have given a show to right here on this network, had her door knocked down by the FBI to take her phone and devices. She's been charged with nothing. They cuffed her. I don't know if you know this, Sheriff Mack, but I had four retired FBI agents for a town hall meeting back last November for four one-hour town halls.
They're on our website at WVWTV.com. One of them, Terry Turchie, is the former Assistant Deputy Director of the Counterterrorism Division of the FBI. He was one of a couple of guys that were there the day they arrested the Unabomber. But he was there with us. Brian Shepard was there, Cecil Moses, David Baldovin all four are distinguished retired FBI guys. One of them again, Terry Turchie, is the former Assistant Deputy Director of the Counterterrorism Division of the FBI. He said, “We're no longer under the rule of law in America.”
And Brian Sheppard was on the FBI SWAT team. He became quite emotional, it's all on video on our website, in that show because he said, "We would have never as FBI agents, SWAT team members, we would have never followed an order that involved us doing what they did to Roger Stone or knocking down people's doors like they're doing to non-violent people." This is where the FBI, the Federal District Attorney, calls the attorney of the individual, says, "Will you please have your client surrender at said time, and they can be arraigned and bailed out and all that good stuff." Roger is a broadcaster here. I know Roger. Roger would have shown up. But no, they had to show up in the dark, predawn with CNN in tow.
Sheriff Mack: Yeah.
Brannon Howse: Now, I'm asking you this because the retired FBI agents said that would have never flown in their day, and we certainly would have never allowed the media to be in tow. And he got choked up because he said, "This is done for one reason, to intimidate the American people." What can a Constitutional Sheriff do if the FBI says, “We're going to come into your county, we're going to start knocking down the door of a few well-known people who there's no known violence. We just don't like them, and we're going to go and do this.” What could a sheriff say? Could a Sheriff say anything to the Feds?
Sheriff Mack: Oh, certainly, absolutely. Yeah, I could give you incident after incident after incident where sheriffs have told FDA, EPA, Army Corps of Engineers, and FBI agents. We all did it in Arizona when I was Sheriff in the late eighties and through the mid-nineties. The FBI was very respectful of us. They kept in communication with us, and they apologized to us. When they did something wrong, we would work with them. But the thing of it is, the person in charge in your county is not the FBI. Some bureaucrat from Washington DC is not in charge of your county. The person in charge of your county is the Sheriff who you appointed, who you elected. Who serves you, and yes, the Sheriff should make a policy for every federal and state agency to check with him before they come in and do that kind of crap in his county.
I know Roger Stone. I just talked to him a couple of weeks ago. What happened to him was absurd. He was, at best, a white-collar criminal who had never committed an act of violence in his life. They use a 26-man SWAT team to go pick him up at his home at 6:00 in the morning. You know what? Next time, FBI, that you need to pick up somebody like that call the local Sheriff and ask him to bring him to you. Because that is how it should have been at Ruby Ridge, Idaho, that is how it should have been a Waco. Instead, the FBI has all these murders on its hands. And I am so glad to know that you have former FBI that are talking like that. One of those four should be the next Director of the FBI.
Brannon Howse: Oh, yeah.
Sheriff Mack: But they keep picking insiders that promote this kind of hard-handed, heavy-booted tactics from law enforcement officials in the federal government. And it is time that they are reined in. It's obvious that Congress doesn't have the courage to do it. So, the FBI, if we could just set national policies with them and DEA and all the other federal agents, the DHS, and now the Czar of Misinformation. They need to let them all know there are a few things, oh, forgot one, the IRS. They need to let them know you're not going to commit crimes or abuse the rights of the citizens in my county. And if you do, I will take action. I've got lots of incidents where sheriffs have done that.
Brannon Howse: Wow, I love to hear that. I want to show you something really quick, and the audience because again, we're always adding new people. Let me go to this clip. This is one of the four one-hour shows we did with those retired FBI agents at WVWTV.com. And I agree with you that one of these four men should be the next FBI director. I like all of them. My choice first would be Terry Turchie, just because he was already working up on the seventh floor as Assistant Deputy Director of the Counterterrorism Division of the FBI. I would urge President Trump in 2024 to make Terry Turchie the next FBI director. But listen to this. I want you to see a little of this, Sheriff. (Video Playing)
Brannon Howse: Tell us what it is you guys as a group are hoping to accomplish as you speak to the American people.
Terry Turchie: Sure. Well, you're all here because you want to have a voice. And probably many of you locally have already made your voice heard. But it's time that people that used to be in the government, people who used to be in the FBI made their voices known as well. I'm sure you all remember the day when you saw an FBI agent testifying in front of the Congress, and they would be warning about the perils of communism and about the dangers facing our society, both internationally and domestically. But you don't see that anymore, and it's really bothering all of us who are up here. So today we decided that, and after Brannon's invitation, which was very generous, Brannon, of course, has been at this for a long time, we decided that we all wanted to come and talk to you together and but want you to realize that the parameters are pretty loose.
We all represent multiple generations of the FBI. And just coincidentally, we just found this out this morning, all four of us began our employment in the FBI as clerical employees. Cecil, down there at the end, began as a clerical employee. I didn't meet Cecil till about the middle of my career or maybe on the early side of my career. And then Brian and I met in New York City and worked together as partners there out in the street for a number of years. Dave, I didn't even meet until after the book came out that Brian had just mentioned. Dave reached out to me because Dave has been doing research on many of these issues that are going to come up today for a long, long time.
Brannon Howse: You can see from his stack of books.
Terry Turchie: Exactly, right. But he's a wealth of knowledge. And so, it's going to be interesting to hear some of the things he has to say. So that gets me to my next point. We're not from the Democratic Party or the Biden campaign, or even the Republican Party. We have not choreographed what we have to say to you today. We're talking from our experience. As I said, Brian and I, for example, worked on communism, the Communist Party, and the Soviet intelligence threat to the country from the streets of New York City, not from the halls of the Department of Justice in Washington, D.C.
We saw firsthand what was going on because we were following people and saw what they were doing and heard what they were saying, and knew from informants and what we called counterintelligence assets what they were up to. So, we've been dealing with this for many, many years. So that's the kind of perspective coming here. But Cecil comes from another direction and Dave another. And so. we didn't rehearse what we had to say to you. We didn't try to make sure we all say the same thing and the same way because that's not our purpose here. Our purpose here is to come here and present information to you on two things that are a very, very significant concern to us.
Terry Turchie: The first one, what I will characterize for you, is the communist infiltration of the United States government. The communist infiltration of a number of our institutions, and the communist ideological ideology and influence today in America's schools. That's a very, very important issue. And people will laugh at that. There are people that are going to, maybe some even after this broadcast, who once again, you know, Turchie or Brian Sheppard or Dave or Cecil are out there holding up the communist banner. They're all from the McCarthy era.
Enough of that. We don't have to back down from that anymore because, in fact, McCarthy was right. We can't back away from this because they want us to back away. Think about this. All the times you've turned the television on in the last few months or during the entire election campaign, really, the only person you heard towards the end of that campaign mention the "C" word, communism, was President Donald Trump. He was the only one who would say it like it was and tell us what was going on out there.
Brannon Howse: I'll give you a little idea. These four retired high-ranking guys are disgusted by the communists they openly state have taken over the Department of Justice. And now they say they've taken over the FBI, and now they're acting like communist thugs and knocking down the doors of people that they shouldn't. You're saying the Sheriff should say to the FBI agents, "You're not going to act that way. If you want to have your district attorney, your federal attorney called their attorney, and you guys go pick them up, bring them to you, that's fine. But we're not going to have this lawlessness, this thuggery."
Sheriff Mack: Yeah. And not only that, on some of the homes that they've done search warrants. I know three or four people, at least in California, who had a search warrant, served on their homes. And they, the FBI, literally handcuff their young children until they were finished with their serving the search warrant and with the search. So, two or three hours, these young children, teenagers and younger, are sitting on the couch handcuffed.
Brannon Howse: We have heard of them in two cases, dragging a young teenager up the stairs by their hoodie. This last year. We heard of them bringing out a teenager in her underwear onto the front lawn.
Sheriff Mack: Yeah. Also, I have footage of the Department of Education serving arrest warrants and serving no-knock search warrants, the Department of Education. I don't know who they borrowed the SWAT team from or if they literally do have their own but this was just ten years ago. A Mr. Right in Stockton, California, got served with a no-knock warrant because his wife, who doesn't even live there anymore, failed to pay her student loan. Yes, on a civil matter such as a student loan. They are using a SWAT team as a collection agency. I have the video, and I actually got it off YouTube, and I think it's still there. Maybe YouTube fell asleep on that one. But this is how out of control the federal government has become.
And it's astonishing to me that those four former FBI agents are talking about how directed they were and focused they were on protecting this nation from communism. And that Perestroika is alive and well, and man, oh, man, are they correct? And now look at how much, just as they said, “We embrace communism in our Department of Education and the NEA, in our schools.” That's probably the worst thing they could have said, but it is absolutely true. And yes, every Sheriff in this country should make sure it does not infiltrate his county and that he protects his people from the thugs that want to come in and do these types of things.
Brannon Howse: Absolutely. So let me ask you this in closing. I have warned this audience before that; sadly, the FBI apparently will set you up. They withhold evidence. They will manufacture evidence. They will lie under oath. They will lie to FISA judges.
Sheriff Mack: All true.
Brannon Howse: And if they have to, they'll just kill you.
Sheriff Mack: I'm afraid that's all true.
Brannon Howse: Even the last part.
Sheriff Mack: I am so sorry to say it. I'm not saying it happens frequently, but I know that it has happened.
Brannon Howse: So, the point I'm making, of course, and you're making is we are law and order people, and the very agencies that we have respected, honored, funded, and worked on behalf of, a lot of those agencies now have been taken over by the Communists? Do you know, the Naked Communists, written by …
Sheriff Mack: Cleon Skousen.
Brannon Howse: He says, “One of the goals of the Communists is to take down the FBI.” What's interesting, they have so infiltrated and corrupted the FBI that now the people wanting to take down the FBI are conservatives. That's how they have flipped it so bad.
Sheriff Mack: There are so many people within our government and within the halls of Congress that totally support this kind of thuggery and violence. And so where do we go, Petition Congress? Give me a break. What a joke. You go to your Sheriff, and you ask him, and you educate him, and you get him to one of our CSPOA seminars, and you make yourself a member of the CSPOA, and you donate to the CSPOA so that we can promote this holy cause, and keep it effective and peaceful. If the American people don't have somebody they can turn to within their own counties and homes, then this will not remain peaceful. The sheriffs must stand, they must interpose, and they must intervene on behalf of the American people, or this will not remain peaceful.
Brannon Howse: So, are you saying that we'll end up with a civil war? Is that what you're saying?
Sheriff Mack: I'm just saying it won't remain peaceful. I'm not going to predict a civil war or anything like that. I think the other side seems to be pushing us to that.
Brannon Howse: Absolutely. Can you point to two or three sheriffs right now that we could use as a model that are guys that we should be respecting?
Sheriff Mack: Oh, yeah.
Brannon Howse: Have other sheriffs look at this, Sheriff. Go look at what they're doing. Follow that model.
Sheriff Mack: Yes. Former Sheriff Brad Rogers in Elkhart County, Indiana. Former sheriff Glen Palmer from Grant County, Oregon. Current Sheriff Bob Songer in Klickitat County, Washington. Current Sheriff Darleaf, D-A-R-L-E-A-F, Berry County, Michigan. Arizona Sheriff Mark Lamb in Pinal County, Arizona. Former Sheriff Nick Finch in Liberty County, Florida. And there are lots of others. There are good ones in Iowa. Good ones in Ohio. Oh, Florida’s got some great sheriffs there. Wayne Ivey, Rick Staly, Grady Judd, and Sheriff Johnson are there. Another Sheriff Johnson, Jeff Johnson, in Georgia.
And these guys are taking strong stands, saying, “They will protect the people from all enemies, both foreign and domestic.” For a sheriff to say, "Well, I'll go after the thugs and the street gangs and street criminals, but I can't do anything if the FBI or any other federal agency or the IRS commits a crime against you, you'll have to get a good lawyer for that." A crime is a crime is a crime. And the Sheriff shouldn't give a free pass to government criminals and then go only after the street criminals. That's absurd. It does not provide anything of significance to his constituents or to the people therein. And we need to get serious about going after the real criminals in this country.
Brannon Howse: Absolutely. Boy, it's been a while since we've had you on. I need to get you on more often. You're a breath of fresh air. CSPOA.org. Sheriff Mack, thank you for your service to our country. As a Sheriff, you're still serving. Thank you so much. I know our audience loves you. It's because someone reminded me, “Hey, you have not had Sheriff Mack on in a while,” so we'll rectify that. We won't go so long visiting with you again.
Sheriff Mack: Thank you so much. Appreciate you. Thank you, my friend.
Brannon Howse: You, too. Sheriff Mack, checking in. I hope you'll check out his website cspoa.org